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French translation in progress
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Reply · Quote Yves (Administrator) #16
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In reply to post ID 3993
You're free to do what you like. :) I'd suggest you upload the ZIP in this thread so that everyone can have a look at it. I can only check the technical aspects, my French is probably not good enough to find errors in detail. (Although my name may imply something else. ;))

Fyi, I have just updated the FAQ page and now the section on editing translation files is back and updated again.
♪ ...nanananah, all in all we’re just brilliant thieves, nanananah... ♪♬
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Reply · Quote davidm #17
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Quote by Yves:
You're free to do what you like. :) I'd suggest you upload the ZIP in this thread so that everyone can have a look at it.

Ok that's what I'll do then

Quote by Yves:
I can only check the technical aspects, my French is probably not good enough to find errors in detail. (Although my name may imply something else. ;))

Yeah true Yves sounds very french and I wonder how it's pronounced in german...

As far as translation checking is concerned, I'll ask Jérémie, I pointed him to this board system and he seemed interrested. Since we both worked on textpattern's translation, I guess that will be a starting point. I'll look for french users here in the Members's list, and I'll advertise this on webmaster-hub.com, which the leading webmasters community.

Quote by Yves:
Fyi, I have just updated the FAQ page and now the section on editing translation files is back and updated again.

Ok I'll make sure I read that, thx
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Reply · Quote Yves (Administrator) #18
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Quote by davidm:
Yeah true Yves sounds very french and I wonder how it's pronounced in german...

Exactly the same. Normally. But some people invent interesting new pronounciations every now and then...
♪ ...nanananah, all in all we’re just brilliant thieves, nanananah... ♪♬
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Reply · Quote davidm #19
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Subject: Done : first draft for FR translation
Ok, I am done and after a quick re-reading, I can know submit a first draft to some fresh eyes :-)

I have announced this on webmaster-hub to get as many testers-correcters I can get, and point here for remarks, corrections, etc. I'll set up a demo with the french language on my hosting service, to help facilitate this process, until opensourcecms demos are updated with 1.6.

I hope french will enjoy UNB as much as I do :-)

Note : I noticed the categories_container div breaks the layout and the page_container div ends up bellow the categories  (in FF and Opera, did not check IE)... I didn't look into it yet, but I mention this since it's not broken here on the forums I guess it's something that you fixed between the dev version from october 3rd that I got and the one you run here (?).
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This post was edited on 2005-10-07, 11:20 by davidm.
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Reply · Quote Yves (Administrator) #20
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Quote by davidm:
the categories_container div breaks the layout and the page_container div ends up bellow the categories

Actually not. I cannot remember to have seen this issue. Is that also with the original languages?

Btw, while we're at it, did you check the change log for new devel versions? There are some notes about updated translation files. You should always keep the base file you're translating to find differences to new files when I update the code. I'll put this in the translation FAQ later then.
♪ ...nanananah, all in all we’re just brilliant thieves, nanananah... ♪♬
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Reply · Quote Yves (Administrator) #21
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In a quick check of the files I have noticed that the files are not valid UTF-8. They are more like ISO-8859-1. I don't think they will be readable this way. The header comment says how these files must be encoded. I'm sorry for this quite unusual way (UTF-8 but without the BOM) but PHP doesn't allow anything else.
♪ ...nanananah, all in all we’re just brilliant thieves, nanananah... ♪♬
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Reply · Quote davidm #22
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Subject: Should be valid now
Yes I know I messed up when I uploaded the file, realized that and changed save preferences in PS Pad, my Editor is now defaulted to utf-8 / UNIX it should be OK now.

I'll change the attachement accordingly in my previous message and set up the fr demo :-)

Edit : Seems like I can't edit my previous post anymore (might be better to modify the unproper attachement).

Thus I attach the new utf-8 valid fr.rar file here.
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Reply · Quote Yves (Administrator) #23
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Thanks for the translation draft. Like some feedback on it? I have just tested it and found some problems with it. Don't get me wrong, it's mostly minor things that are easy to fix. I'm kind of a perfectionsist... :)

  • With "register" and "login" I thought of two different things. Registering is creating the user account, logging in is, well, visiting the board.
  • "Group memberships" is untranslated.
  • Main navigation: "membres" and user profile: "messages" are lowercase.
  • Isn't "MB" (megabyte) in French "Mo" (megaoctet or so)?
  • Decimal point in French should be a comma ",". Not sure about the thousands grouping, is that a space " "?
  • "Il n'y a pas de sous-forum en dessous du forum courant" - False negative. There _are_ subforums...
  • "un utilisateur est en ligne" etc should begin with a capital letter
  • "préférences avancées pour ce forum" should begin with a capital letter. Seems to be a common problem.
  • Aren't the correct quotation marks « and » and the apostroph ’ instead of " and ' ?
  • "Catégories" from the forum edit form should be singular I think
  • "Mod?teur du forum" (should be Forums editor), "Inverser la s?ction" and "Vous pouvez renseigner vos centres d'int?ts" look a little defective
  • same for "Les 10 sujets les plus visit?ces deux dernières semaines :" plus the space before the colon
  • "Réduction auto (avatars)" why is that in brackets?
  • The description of the "Masquer les images" sounds wrong. It means the post attachment images, not those inserted by the [img] tag in the message body.
  • "La taille maximum est de 200×200 pixels et 40 kBits." - Bits? Should be bytes.
  • "...au cache de votre navigateur : il vous suffit..." there's a space before the colon. Same for "...Port par défaut : 5222..."
  • "L\utilisation de la fonction mail()"
  • "Considérer l'utilisateur comme ‘déconnecté (hors ligne) après" looks incomplete (quotes)
  • "L'enregistrement de nouveaux utilisateurs peut aussi être entièrement Désactivé" - last word is capitalised, no full stop at the end.
  • "Liste des membres | Liste des Modérateurs" - why is "Modérateurs" written uppercase?
  • Userlist order "Date d'enreg." doesn't need to be abbreviated
  • "précédent" and "suivant" are only used for pages so they can be the same form as with "Page suivante".
  • The default date format definitions are incorrect. I see some "PM" where a year number should be. Please refer to the PHP documentation for the date() function for the correct date format identifiers.

I've noticed that translation uses the "formal" language (votre, vous...). From what I've heard this is more common in French. My German translation uses the informal language by default. But since there are requests for a formal German translation, I or someone else will probably add that variant, too.

To make an even more complete translation, you can also look at the plug-in translations which are located with each plug-in in the unb_lib/plugins/ directory. The ACL editor, groups editor and wordfilter are most important now, more will follow to implement the Admin tools that were in UNB 1.5.
♪ ...nanananah, all in all we’re just brilliant thieves, nanananah... ♪♬
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Reply · Quote davidm #24
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Member since Apr 2005 · 40 posts · Location: Paris, France
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Ok Yves thanks for this very precise feedback on what changes there is to be made :-)

I'll look into it one by one. I thought I had corrected the bytes <=> octets (and not bits) thing, thanks I'll correct that. The missing capitals are due to a use of the replacement function of my text editors that I used after converting to utf-8 (I had a lot of ? for instance préférences became pr?f?rence I had to correct the whole thing aferwards thus the mistakes...). I'll correct that too (but with a pair of fresh eyes, in the morning ;-p)

Thanks for the pointer about the plugins, I have found out this when looking for the groups editor translation (which appeared in german while the rest was in english). I'll take care of this too :-)

I too am a perfectionnist, I'll hone this to a fine tuned translation :-)

I think I'll have this fixed tomorrow, thanks for your time on this !
My favorite CMS : MODx | Textpattern
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Reply · Quote Yves (Administrator) #25
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Quote by davidm:
Thanks for the pointer about the plugins, I have found out this when looking for the groups editor translation (which appeared in german while the rest was in english). I'll take care of this too :-)

Those weren't translated in the RC 1, I forgot them, too. (And the board will find a file in any language if the preferred one doesn't exist...) But the next development versions had an English translation of them.

I too am a perfectionnist, I'll hone this to a fine tuned translation :-)

Good to hear. :)
♪ ...nanananah, all in all we’re just brilliant thieves, nanananah... ♪♬
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Reply · Quote davidm #26
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In reply to post #23
[quote=Yves]
  • With "register" and "login" I thought of two different things. Registering is creating the user account, logging in is, well, visiting the board.[/quote]

Well there is no confusion for me about that, and I didn't find inconsistencies but I admit I might have missed something.
Login can mean "Identifiant" if we are talking of the Login or "Se connecter" if it's the action of Logging in.
Register is "Créer un compte" or could also be translated by "S'enregistrer".

I'll recheck this...

Quote by Yves:
* "Group memberships" is untranslated.

I am currently doing this, and I'll upload it once I am done, along with the other plugins.

Quote by Yves:
* The description of the "Masquer les images" sounds wrong. It means the post attachment images, not those inserted by the [img] tag in the message body.

I could replace "Masquer les images" by "Remplacer les images par un lien de téléchargement", but no I did not get this one wrong. The explanation string is consistent : the inserted image gets replaced by a download link.

Quote by Yves:
* "Réduction auto (avatars)" why is that in brackets?

I guess I could have chosen a more litteral translation like "Petits Avatars" but it seemed ambiguous and the goal I try to achieve when translating is stick to the spirit rather than the letter. English is far more concise than french. Two words strings can easily be turned into six or seven words to convey the same meaning. This can be a problem and there are ways to use the french language in a more synthetic commonly accepted way. That's what I am trying to do, always keeping in mind the important thing is to be clear and concise.

The thing I plan to do is list all the strings for which I am not satisfied with and debate them with french users to achieve the best possible translation.

Quote by Yves:
I've noticed that translation uses the "formal" language (votre, vous...). From what I've heard this is more common in French. My German translation uses the informal language by default. But since there are requests for a formal German translation, I or someone else will probably add that variant, too.

True the french language tends to be formal and translations aim at being satisfactory for the widest base of users (which include corporate environnements...). This being done, people can maintain their own "less formal" translations if they so wish...

Quote by Yves:
To make an even more complete translation, you can also look at the plug-in translations which are located with each plug-in in the unb_lib/plugins/ directory. The ACL editor, groups editor and wordfilter are most important now, more will follow to implement the Admin tools that were in UNB 1.5.

Will do. I started the groups editor and will publish those here when done...

Quote by Yves:
* Aren't the correct quotation marks « and » and the apostroph ’ instead of " and ' ?

Yes indeed, but it's the first time someone points this out.
« and ’ are special characters not accessed via keyboard and I have always worked with the \' approach not the ’ which is a shame since it's bothersome to add a \ sign each time you have an ’

I corrected all files accordingly, and will update this once I am done re-reading it :-)
My favorite CMS : MODx | Textpattern
My websites : david-molliere.net | nodeo.net
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Reply · Quote Yves (Administrator) #27
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Member since Jan 2004 · 3740 posts · Location: Erlangen, Germany
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[quote=davidm:1128855934]
Quote by Yves:
  • With "register" and "login" I thought of two different things. Registering is creating the user account, logging in is, well, visiting the board.[/quote]

Well there is no confusion for me about that, and I didn't find inconsistencies but I admit I might have missed something.
Login can mean "Identifiant" if we are talking of the Login or "Se connecter" if it's the action of Logging in.
Register is "Créer un compte" or could also be translated by "S'enregistrer".

Ah I see. "Login" is always used in the meaning of "to login" here, never as "Login ID". Register is meant as "create an account". I'm not sure what "s'enregistrer" means exactly, but "créer un compte" should be ok.

Quote by Yves:
* The description of the "Masquer les images" sounds wrong. It means the post attachment images, not those inserted by the [img] tag in the message body.

I could replace "Masquer les images" by "Remplacer les images par un lien de téléchargement", but no I did not get this one wrong. The explanation string is consistent : the inserted image gets replaced by a download link.

I would understand "inserted image" as one you have used in your post with the [img] tag, not an attachment. And this option only affects attachment. [img] images are not affected by this option, they are always displayed.

Quote by Yves:
* "Réduction auto (avatars)" why is that in brackets?

I guess I could have chosen a more litteral translation like "Petits Avatars" but it seemed ambiguous and the goal I try to achieve when translating is stick to the spirit rather than the letter. English is far more concise than french. Two words strings can easily be turned into six or seven words to convey the same meaning. This can be a problem and there are ways to use the french language in a more synthetic commonly accepted way. That's what I am trying to do, always keeping in mind the important thing is to be clear and concise.

Yes, that's good, but "réduction auto" itself doesn't tell much about avatars, does it?

Quote by Yves:
* Aren't the correct quotation marks « and » and the apostroph ’ instead of " and ' ?

Yes indeed, but it's the first time someone points this out.
« and ’ are special characters not accessed via keyboard and I have always worked with the \' approach not the ’ which is a shame since it's bothersome to add a \ sign each time you have an ’

’ is Alt+0146 on Windows. « is Alt+0171, » is Alt+0187. Open the character map (charmap.exe) and select the character. In the bottom right of the window it will tell you the keyboard shortcut. Often this is only the ANSI code but I for instance got used to the English and German quotation character very well. I'm using them on this website very often... ;) Other systems than Windows may not offer this feature though, at least I haven't found it yet.
♪ ...nanananah, all in all we’re just brilliant thieves, nanananah... ♪♬
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Reply · Quote davidm #28
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Subject: Points taken
I will stop the "quote cascade"  ;-)   and just do a quick reply...

Once again thanks Yves for clarifying, I had indeed mistaken the part about the the image being replaced by a download link : I'll correct this as well as those other points.

I'll upload the last modifications tonight :-)
My favorite CMS : MODx | Textpattern
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Reply · Quote davidm #29
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Subject: Testing the translation, gathering users feedback
I have setup a temporary "UNB in french" demo on my hosting service, started gathering feedback and making corrections :-) One thing while I am here : I installed the demo in a folder and not in root, and rewrite rules do not work, does it mean I have to add a line with rewrite base /unb to .htaccess ?

I still have to translate the plugins though. One thing I noticed is if there is no plugins translation available, when set language is set to auto the system falls back on german, not english which would be more "logical", no ?
My favorite CMS : MODx | Textpattern
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Reply · Quote Yves (Administrator) #30
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You could try the RewriteBase directive that's in a comment there, yes.

First it tries to find the current language for a plug-in. If it's not found, it tries to use the board default language. In the end it uses the first it can get and finally it uses none. If it cannot find the first one, an error will be logged. And if it does something else, it's a bug....
♪ ...nanananah, all in all we’re just brilliant thieves, nanananah... ♪♬
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